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11 July 2010 @ 07:15 am
Don't mind me, I just love my multiships.  
++ By marathoning Dark Angel I revisited one of my favorite pairings. Now obviously the main ship of the show was Max/Logan, and yeah I can see the potential for Alec/Max too. However my pairing during the run, and still is to this day, is Zack/Max. I know I may be in the minority, but there was serious chemistry between them. It was even implied on the show at certain times that Zack looked at her more than in a brotherly way. In the episode "Blah Blah Woof Woof" for example, and even in a later episode when he tells her that there was no possible way he could ever forget her. Obviously it was seen as one-sided given how protective Zack was over Max, but had the show gone that route I wouldn't have been surprised.

And because this is a rarepairing there are hardly any fic about them, unfortunately. I remember reading one long ago, way back when ff.net allowed NC17 stories on their site, but other than that no dice. :(

++ SUPERNATURAL PAIRING MEME

One True Pairing Ship:

DEAN/CASTIEL. Obviously, come on now. I don't really need to explain this, do I?


Canon Ship:

Sam/Jessica. ♥ I have such a soft spot for those two, like seriously. They were utterly adorable together and I felt had Jessica actually stayed alive yet Sam still got into hunting anyway for whatever reason and she tagged along, she would have been good for him, you know? She had that purity and innocence about her, and would have grounded Sam when his brother couldn't on certain things, since we know they go head to head sometimes and I think with Jessica around more often she would have been kind of his conscience, and he wouldn't have gone the direction he did.


"If this happens I'll stab my eyes out with a spork" Ship:

It's clearly a fanon thing but, Sam/Castiel. I like them having an awkward and estranged kind of friendship and being cool with each other than detesting the other for whatever reason, but romantically? Yeah, I don't think so. Only for the crack-induced and the lulz, but otherwise the very thought of them together is kind of hilariously ridiculous.

Dean/Lisa. Illogical, unnecessary, unhealthy, stupid, random, etc. This entire random thing of adding Lisa into the mix at the last second just fills me with such rage and makes me wonder why this was even approved into the script in the first place, since it makes absolutely no sense in the continuity of not just the show and the story but to the characters as well. It was just added to give Dean something to latch onto when everything was over and it makes a nice character like Lisa being mistreated and misused for that purpose alone and just, ugh. NO. JUST NO. DO NOT WANT EVER, KILL IT WITH FIRE!


Guilty Pleasure Ship:

S3!Ruby/Castiel. I can't really explain it other than the possibility of Katie!Ruby and Castiel is kind of hot, plus that Ruby was far more amazing and kickass that the second version ever would be, and that's just facts bbs. She and Castiel could do amazing things together, it would have been awesome. And Dean would watch and possibly join in. ;)


"I dabble a little" Ship:
Sam/Gabriel. I don't know, there's just something about the pairing that has gotten a hold on me.

Castiel/Lucifer, because after "Abandon All Hope" how can I not dabble a little into that kind of possibility?

Back in S3 I dabbled a little in Dean/Ruby, mostly due to "Malleus Maleficarum" and how much Katie and Jensen had that kind of chemistry in their scenes from that episode alone. It's what got me thinking that okay, the implications are there, why the hell not?

Chuck/Becky, even though it's blatantly the self-inserts for Kripke and Gamble, as fictional characters by themselves I find them absolutely adorable and kind of forget everything the finale said and, in my version, Chuck and Becky are off elsewhere with their geeky love and Chuck is sharing his latest stories with her before they are set off to be published and Becky is slowly started to be converted into a Dean/Castiel fangirl in the process, lol

"It's like a car crash" Ship:
Sam/Ruby 2.0, because it was such a disastuh! Like seriously, nothing good came out of it. I'm definitely not a fan for many reasons, but mainly because it drove Sam down the wrong path entirely.

Also, others have mentioned it and the more I think about it the more I realize it's absolutely true: future!Dean/future!Castiel. Like, the devastation of their relationship, how despite that future!Castiel stayed at Dean's side as the world started crashing down that they just grew apart from each other, future!Dean and his cynicism and cold-heart especially. Not just in fanfiction where their relationship is explored more but the implications in canon that future!Castiel liked past!Dean, how he preferred that Dean to the future!Dean, how future!Dean would sacrifice him in a blink of an eye just to focus on the main objective. It's a train wreck, it's heartbreaking like whoa. ;__;


"Tickles my fancy but not sold just yet" Ship:
Dean/Gabriel. Especially after "Hammer of the Gods" because their bantering and snark and innuendos were pure gold there. I'm not particularly sold on them just yet, but again, there's always room for possibilities.


"Makes no canon sense but why the hell not" Ship:
Castiel/Crowley. I think perhaps it's my giant wish to see more Castiel/Crowley scenes in the future because they hardly got to share anything together this last season, and come on the banter between them would be fantastic. Crowley can make innuendo jokes and Castiel can tilt his head in confusion. Or, alternatively, Gabriel/Crowley mostly for the same reasons, and also the snark between them would be beautiful. ;D

Jo/Castiel. I have no idea why this is, but after seeing plenty of videos from the Heaven In Hell Convention with Misha and Alona doing panels together, I find myself kind of shifting to the possibility that yeah, sure, it could work in some odd kind of way. Or, maybe that's more going towards Misha/Alona but since I only do strictly mild RPF this is the other solution.

Jo/Ruby 1.0, and I blame this solely on a piece of fanfic I read, Slow Spinning Redemption, which really intrigued me and it's one of the few femmeslash pairings in the fandom I really do enjoy. It makes no canonical sense at all, but again most rarepairings never do anyway. Heh.

I also do crossover pairings as well, like incredibly multifandom crack!pairings for various characters and many different alternative situations. Those also make no canonical sense because neither are part of each others canonical universes, but I love them regardless because it sets up those amazing possibilities if they were involved in some way.


"Everyone else loves it but I just don't feel it" Ship:
Sam/Dean. I'm just not into Wincest. I don't see it or feel it, which makes me kind of shunned by the majority of fandom as a default because of that, but whatever.

"When all is said and done" Ship:
John/Mary. ♥ Even though the show is trying to make John seem like a larger asshole than he actually was as the seasons continue, they pretty much are the OTP of the show canonically since the beginning. I love the flashbacks of seeing them as their younger selves, they were so very much in love and it pains my heart to know what happens to them later on in their lives. But even with that, they were adorable and I love them so much.


++ I watched the premiere episode of Haven yesterday, and it's pretty good. It was kind of shaky in the beginning, but once the episode started moving with the mystery it really found its footing and I really like the characters towards the end. It has much potential, and the ending gives that suspenseful "something more is up here" kind of feel which I personally like. So yeah. I like the main leading character, she started to really hold her own at the end as well. Since this is the starting point we'll see how the rest of the show goes but as for right now, I give my approval stamp. Now I gotta download Eureka because I needs my James Callis fix. ;)

Though interestingly, I had a dream recently that Misha Collins was to guest-star on Eureka, except he would play Castiel who mysteriously got transported into that universe...and he was there searching to buy himself a fedora similar to what James character wears as seen in promotional pictures. Just goes to show what my brain conjures up, and how much I really want Misha and James Callis to do something together. Hehe.
 
 
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just a small town girl: [supernatural] archangel gabrielcarameltrap on July 11th, 2010 03:04 pm (UTC)
I always have this idea that should Jess have come along, she probably would have made a pretty handy hunter with the boys.

I enjoy Sam/Gabriel a lot more than I should. I particularly like how some writers would bring them together.

There has been a Jo/Lucifer ship going around.
Renée: Dean/Castiel. Between us.rogueslayer452 on July 11th, 2010 07:56 pm (UTC)
That's what I think, too. Even with amateurish training from them she would have been a great addition along with the boys and would have done well as a hunter. Of course this is only going by speculation because we only knew Jessica for a very brief moment, but I would think after getting over the initial shock about Sam's background she would have been all for joining in that lifestyle and helping them out. Jessica would have made a badass hunter and they know it.

I love seeing the different scenarios for bringing Sam and Gabriel together, some of them even are very plausible and could definitely work on the show.

Hmmm, Jo/Lucifer. That's a new one, interesting.
noybusiness on July 11th, 2010 03:36 pm (UTC)
Sam/Dean. I'm just not into Wincest. I don't see it or feel it, which makes me kind of shunned by the majority of fandom as a default because of that, but whatever.

Me too. I can only buy it if one or more of them has become a vampire or other form of evil mind-controller. I think it's kind of sad that all the Shipping Fics in the Fanfic Recs page for Supernatural on TV Tropes are Sam/Dean (except for one Dean/Castiel).

Now obviously the main ship of the show was Max/Logan, and yeah I can see the potential for Alec/Max too. However my pairing during the run, and still is to this day, is Zack/Max.

It's funny. I was introduced to the fandom by Max/Alec works, but when I got into watching the show I realized Max/Logan was the OTP and Max and Alec worked better as siblings. I've heard people say that Max and Alec would gotten together if there had been a third season. Realistically, I think they would have had a brief hookup and regretted it. I wish Alec would have gotten a girlfriend, preferably a human. For that matter, I wish Original Cindy would have gotten a transgenic girlfriend.
Renée: Six. It's good to be a Cylon.rogueslayer452 on July 11th, 2010 07:52 pm (UTC)
I think it's kind of sad that all the Shipping Fics in the Fanfic Recs page for Supernatural on TV Tropes are Sam/Dean (except for one Dean/Castiel).

Yeah, well, that's because Sam/Dean are the majority in fandom. Which you know, it's okay, but there are other pairings out there too especially now. Perhaps TV Tropes needs to be updated?

I was introduced to the fandom by Max/Alec works, but when I got into watching the show I realized Max/Logan was the OTP and Max and Alec worked better as siblings.

They really do work better as siblings, they just have that sibling kind of banter working out. Which is why I only dabbled a bit in that ship, but wasn't really hardcore about it because they had more of a brother-sister vibe. Plus, Alec was Ben's twin and I think, for Max, it would have been kind of weird and awkward. And yeah, getting together in the third season? I don't think so. In the finale Max and Logan were very still hooked with each other, despite not being able to touch, so I agree if that ever happened they would have regretted it immediately. I think Alec knew his boundaries with Max on that subject, too.
noybusiness on July 11th, 2010 08:07 pm (UTC)
In the finale Max and Logan were very still hooked with each other, despite not being able to touch, so I agree if that ever happened they would have regretted it immediately.

Yeah, and the finale was filmed well before the surprise cancellation, so that can't have been rushing.

I think Alec knew his boundaries with Max on that subject, too.

I think it's telling that he doesn't use her ruse to Logan as an excuse to hit on her.

they just have that sibling kind of banter

And fighting over Asha's diary!
Renée: Kahlan. Facepalm.rogueslayer452 on July 11th, 2010 08:24 pm (UTC)
I didn't know that they canceled the show after that, I thought because of the finale and that James Cameron who directed it, it was a surefire thing and that's why the finale was more bigger than the previous one had been. Huh, interesting.

lol, yeah, serious sibling behavior right there. Which is why even though I see the possible potential, it's clear that they were merely just friends at the end of the season.
noybusiness on July 11th, 2010 08:50 pm (UTC)
Oh no, they were even told they had a third season before cancellation.
Renée: Cara. Warrior.rogueslayer452 on July 11th, 2010 09:53 pm (UTC)
Well, how rude. :/ Stupid FOX, destroyer of good shows.
noybusiness: JensenCloseupnoybusiness on July 11th, 2010 08:11 pm (UTC)
Yeah, well, that's because Sam/Dean are the majority in fandom. Which you know, it's okay, but there are other pairings out there too especially now. Perhaps TV Tropes needs to be updated?

Like Dean/Castiel or (gasp) a pairing with a girl in it. Although I realize it's partly the show format that leads to this.
bold_seer: bsgbold_seer on July 11th, 2010 03:38 pm (UTC)
a fedora similar to what James character wears as seen in promotional pictures

O_O I have no idea what the show's about, but clearly, I need to see that. Because while fedoras aren't quite trench coat level awesome, they're still very cool. (And I support your dream world, too. :P)

Renée: Six/Gaius. Your destiny awaits.rogueslayer452 on July 11th, 2010 07:37 pm (UTC)
It's a very fun and quirky show, they're switching things up a bit for the new season with James Callis' character I've heard, but yeah. I have a thing about fedoras. I have a few myself, they're awesome.

(hehe, my dreamworld has all sorts of interesting, and sometimes disturbing, things happening. I'm just waiting for my dream!Tricia and dream!Misha to pop in again....)
Kay: SPN // Lucifer // i'm an angelaeon_entwined on July 11th, 2010 04:22 pm (UTC)
NO. JUST NO. DO NOT WANT EVER, KILL IT WITH FIRE!

OMFG THIS. WHY DID IT HAPPEN? WHY?? SENSE, THIS SHIT MAKES NONE. *RAAAAAGE*

Anyways, I think I'm more or less sold on Lucifer/Castiel now. JSYK. >.>
Renée: Castiel/Lucifer. Angels of the Lord.rogueslayer452 on July 11th, 2010 07:33 pm (UTC)
BECAUSE SERA GAMBLE IS THE STEPHANIE MEYER OF THE SHOW, APPARENTLY. *FUMES AND RAGES WITH YOU*

Cas/Lucifer! ;D \O/ So many possibilities, bb.
noybusiness: JensenCloseupnoybusiness on July 11th, 2010 08:19 pm (UTC)
WHY DID IT HAPPEN? WHY??

Because they were serving Dean's character rather than Lisa's? Which to a certain extent is understandable with him being a series lead.
Renée: Six. Warrior of God.rogueslayer452 on July 11th, 2010 08:29 pm (UTC)
But even so, I consider that to be a huge disregard for both their character storylines because it really didn't make sense after everything, you know? I would have liked it if they even shown a smidgen of consideration for Lisa's character rather than make it seem like she was waiting for Dean all these years, which of course she wasn't. Then again, the treatment of women on the show isn't exactly their highest praises. And everything about the last several episodes of the season were so rushed and so randomly placed that they barely took much consideration for the characters and their particular arcs, most of them got shafted in the end.
I need more fandoms like CKR needs more sexy: SPN- Comics Resivedlove_jackianto on July 11th, 2010 04:28 pm (UTC)
Are you me? Those are pretty much all the answers I would give.

'One True Pairing Ship:

DEAN/CASTIEL. Obviously, come on now. I don't really need to explain this, do I?'

No you don't.

Dean/Lisa
It was just added to give Dean something to latch onto when everything was over and it makes a nice character like Lisa being mistreated and misused for that purpose alone and just, ugh. NO. JUST NO. DO NOT WANT EVER, KILL IT WITH FIRE!

Tell me about. I think what I dislike most about that pairing (besides the fact it feels really tacked on and made no sense for either character) is the implication that Lisa spent YEARS waiting for Dean, a man she barely knew. I'm hoping they do more with Lisa than make her JUST Dean's love interest, but with Sera's track record for writing female characters and shoving them into love interest roles (in particular Anna), I'm not holding out much hope. If Ben does turns out to be Dean's because Lisa lied about it the first time, I'm not sure how I would feel.

'Castiel/Lucifer, because after 'Abandon All Hope' how can I not dabble a little into that kind of possibility?'
Oh the possibilities.

'future!Dean/future!Castiel. Like, the devastation of their relationship, how despite that future!Castiel stayed at Dean's side as the world started crashing down that they just grew apart from each other, future!Dean and his cynicism and cold-heart especially.'
It was an interesting look at how different their relationship could be. I loved when Past!Dean asked if Cas was also going to be sacrificed to the meat grinder too and Future!Dean looked down as if he was ashamed about that. It really said a lot about not only Future!Dean and Future!Cas' relationship but also Past!Dean's relationship with Cas that he would ask about Cas specifically.

'Everyone else loves it but I just don't feel it' Ship:
Sam/Dean. I'm just not into Wincest. I don't see it or feel it, which makes me kind of shunned by the majority of fandom as a default because of that, but whatever.'

Me too. I can why people ship it but I don't see it myself.

'Even though the show is trying to make John seem like a larger asshole than he actually was as the seasons continue'
Ah, truer words were never spoken. Heck, in Dark Side Of The Moon they implied that John might have actually hit Dean when John found out Sam ran away.


Edited at 2010-07-11 04:30 pm (UTC)
Renée: Castiel. Guardian angel.rogueslayer452 on July 11th, 2010 07:29 pm (UTC)
Hee! Perhaps I am you, perhaps we are separated at birth from ~another time~ or something. ;p

I think what I dislike most about that pairing (besides the fact it feels really tacked on and made no sense for either character) is the implication that Lisa spent YEARS waiting for Dean, a man she barely knew.

That is what really gripes me the most, actually. There's absolutely no regard for Lisa as a character and a person. Especially when you look at the timeline of how Dean only met her once for a quickie, then years later decided at random on his own impulse to impose on her life again for the possibility for another quickie, and then three years goes by after that incident with her kid in the third season he returns hoping that she would have put her life on hold for him? Fuck that noise, that's just a disservice to not only Lisa as a character but to all women who have had men coming in and out of their lives at random thinking they would have a shot.

If Ben does turns out to be Dean's because Lisa lied about it the first time, I'm not sure how I would feel.

Me neither. :/

I plan on having a rant/meta about this because I really have issues with how it was handled.

It really said a lot about not only Future!Dean and Future!Cas' relationship but also Past!Dean's relationship with Cas that he would ask about Cas specifically.

Oh, definitely. And I think because of seeing this Dean really realized how much he cared and appreciated his Castiel for who he is, which is what prompted him to say "don't ever change" when he returned to the present time. Because he really wanted to make it clear that he liked Castiel who he was and wants it to stay that way. Although why we didn't get more indication on that relationship in the latter half of the season, and the finale specifically, I don't even know. I find that incredibly strong point in their relationship based on this episode alone.

Ah, truer words were never spoken. Heck, in Dark Side Of The Moon they implied that John might have actually hit Dean when John found out Sam ran away.

I know! John might not have been the perfect father figure, but he's definitely not what they're making him out to be on the show. I somehow feel like perhaps someone on the writing staff might be reading too much into fanfiction about abusive!John towards the boys or something, because that's the only thing I see when they continue to make those implications on the actual show. :/
I need more fandoms like CKR needs more sexylove_jackianto on July 12th, 2010 05:03 pm (UTC)
'Fuck that noise, that's just a disservice to not only Lisa as a character but to all women who have had men coming in and out of their lives at random thinking they would have a shot.'
Hear! Hear! I also have to wonder why Lisa would even want an unstable guy like Dean in her life anyway; she has to know that Dean's lifestyle could put Ben in danger. I'm sure there are quite a few demons and even hunters who would hurt Ben because it would hurt Dean. Not to mention a guy that's implied to be an alcoholic suffering from PTSD (who would dump her and Ben in a second if Sam came calling) probably wouldn't be the best role modal for her son. But than I realized I probably think more about Dean/Lisa (and Lisa as a character in general) than the writers did/will.

'I plan on having a rant/meta about this because I really have issues with how it was handled.'
Oh please rant away.

'I find that incredibly strong point in their relationship based on this episode alone.'
It was.

'Although why we didn't get more indication on that relationship in the latter half of the season, and the finale specifically, I don't even know. I find that incredibly strong point in their relationship based on this episode alone.'
It's a shame they didn't deal with Dean and Cas' relationship more after that, but I guess Kripke wanted to focus on Sam and Dean and Dean and Cas (and Cas in general) got pushed to the side. Like I've said before, Kripke has always had trouble writing beyond Sam and Dean. I always took Dean's 'What do we do now' line in Swan Song to mean that he wanted Cas to stay, but he didn't know how to actually tell him that (when does Dean ever ask for anything for himself?), so hopefully there will be more Dean/Cas friendship in season six.

'I somehow feel like perhaps someone on the writing staff might be reading too much into fanfiction about abusive!John towards the boys or something, because that's the only thing I see when they continue to make those implications on the actual show. :/'
That seems like the only logical answer.
smashedpeaches: darkangelsmashedpeaches on July 11th, 2010 05:10 pm (UTC)
I had a Dark Angel marathon back in the fall. I watched cause I love Michael Weatherly but by rewatching I learn I like Jensen as well. That's what got me watching SPN. Know that I've watched SPN I love Jensen.
Renéerogueslayer452 on July 11th, 2010 07:11 pm (UTC)
It's kind of interesting though, because Alec is pretty much the same as Dean in S1 of SPN; same kind of attitude and personality, which makes it hard not to think of Alec as Dean when I'm rewatching. I also recognized Jensen due to Dark Angel, even though I didn't start watching SPN until its second season.
Tracy: Dark Angelalexwhitman25 on July 11th, 2010 06:12 pm (UTC)
I always loved Zack. I was never much of a Logan fan (expect for having a weird thing for Logan/Alec) so I shipped Max/Zack until Alec showed up.

I'm not sold on Eureka's newest twist, but that show can be such fun.



Renée: LotS. Kahlan/Cara.rogueslayer452 on July 11th, 2010 07:05 pm (UTC)
Zack was such a great character, it's bittersweet how he ended up but his character was a great recurring addition on the show and I loved the indications between him and Max.

Eureka is definitely fun, and I have yet to see the new episode but I admit, I'm mostly gonna be watching for James. ;)
Filomena: im a dorkaubade_saudade on July 11th, 2010 06:36 pm (UTC)
Sam/Dean. I'm just not into Wincest. I don't see it or feel it, which makes me kind of shunned by the majority of fandom as a default because of that, but whatever.

lol shu- shu- shunnnn the unbeliever? seriously?

anyways, Sam/Dean is a lot tinnier ship than it used to be (like a yacht when it used to be a cruise). just look at the spn newsletter, Sam/Lucifer gets about as many fanfics these days.

Misha Collins should do Mad Men. he'd look gorgeous in a fedora. plus, he totally reminds me of Montgomery Clift.


Renée: Cara. Archangel.rogueslayer452 on July 11th, 2010 06:56 pm (UTC)
anyways, Sam/Dean is a lot tinnier ship than it used to be (like a yacht when it used to be a cruise). just look at the spn newsletter, Sam/Lucifer gets about as many fanfics these days.

I disagree with that. Even though there are more variety of pairings now because of more characters being introduced, Sam/Dean still remains the majority of the SPN fandom overall. Dean/Castiel is coming in second close. And honestly, a newsletter isn't exactly an accurate indication of statistics of shippers for a fandom as a whole.
Filomena: pink glassesaubade_saudade on July 11th, 2010 10:34 pm (UTC)
maybe i'm just in different circles, or it's just the naive newbish perspective, but it seems to moi like the SPN fandom is surprisingly promiscuous in its ship-loves. ;D fansluts...


a newsletter isn't exactly an accurate indication of statistics of shippers for a fandom as a whole.


no, but it might indicate future interest.

maybe i'm giving fanart and fanfic too much credit, but i'd say that in Fandom fan output is as powerful an influence for shipping preference as canon. i, for one, came looking for gen (i ♥ gen) and was convinced of the possibility (or impossibility as in the case of Dean/Lisa) of a ship by fics.

for me ((((though i have my preferences with gen or Dean/Sam or Dean/Castiel & Sam --because the Sam&Dean intensity has to be there imo to make it canon~faithful-- and the truth is i love me a very passionate & asexual Castiel)))) the writing comes first and if an author does their job then they can persuade me of their ship, no matter how ridonkulous it might appear outside that little fic bubble.
Encyclopædia Clevername: SPN metallicarthefreshchuff on July 11th, 2010 08:47 pm (UTC)
Even though the show is trying to make John seem like a larger asshole than he actually was as the seasons continue

Ugh, you're absolutely right about that. Having a second family, another son, him and Mary fighting, "their marriage was only perfect after she died", I hated all that. I liked Mary/John being the shining example of love and normal life, because that was what the boys were fighting to protect! Besides, if you're going to keep tearing down John's character, at least bring JDM back on the show to defend himself. (Pretty, pretty please!)
Renée: SIR. BB COME BACK.rogueslayer452 on July 11th, 2010 09:51 pm (UTC)
It's one of the things that pisses me off about how the show has been conducting their random facts and failing to really acknowledge the continuity of passed seasons, because it really just doesn't fit with who John Winchester is. He wasn't Father of the Year or anything, but he wasn't an abusive and neglectful asshole of a father they're painting him to be (and by neglectful, I mean post-hunter days, when he and Mary were married, because that to me that ain't right and neither was Dean's comment about their marriage, either). And I agree, if they're gonna talk shit about John on the show at least have JDM return to properly defend his side for the character.

It makes me wonder why they haven't done so already. I know that JDM has been busy with movie projects lately but, didn't he express that he would love to return to the show? Is he too expensive now for the show or something?

Edited at 2010-07-11 09:52 pm (UTC)
Encyclopædia Clevername: SPN Castielthefreshchuff on July 11th, 2010 11:38 pm (UTC)
He's definitely said several times he'd love to come back! I don't know why they haven't yet, unless it's a money thing, because they keep bringing other people back from the grave. The episode they went up to heaven could've been perfect -- even that flashback of their high school days, they could've had him cameo. Hell, have Castiel kip on up to heaven and drag John down for a day, I don't even care, I just want my JDM!

(I remember in the episodes leading up to the Apocalypse I thought it would've been cool if Castiel amassed some kind of army from heaven, bringing back some of the dead hunters and things from past seasons to help fight Lucifer. Of course, my only interest in the idea would've been so JDM's gorgeous ass could come striding in, but still, it would've been cooler than just having a couple guys shout at each other in a graveyard and call it an Apocalypse *grumble grumble*)

Damn, I need a JDM icon.
Renée: Misha. !!!!!rogueslayer452 on July 12th, 2010 01:03 am (UTC)
The budget issue and scheduling are the only things I keep coming back to, because if JDM expresses his interest to come back then I don't see any reason to deny him that. I'm sure he'd place whatever aside to join the party again. Regarding the Heaven thing I agree, though it's interesting that they made a mention that neither John or Mary's souls could be located in Heaven. So this begs the question, where are they? They keep bringing up all this stuff yet never really explaining it further, unless that's what the sixth season is going to be about, but I doubt it.

I remember in the episodes leading up to the Apocalypse I thought it would've been cool if Castiel amassed some kind of army from heaven, bringing back some of the dead hunters and things from past seasons to help fight Lucifer. Of course, my only interest in the idea would've been so JDM's gorgeous ass could come striding in, but still, it would've been cooler than just having a couple guys shout at each other in a graveyard and call it an Apocalypse *grumble grumble*

Can I just say MAJOR WORD to all of this? Because I had the exact same thoughts about them making the apocalypse more grander than they did in the finale, with just talking / lame toy soldier gag to make Sam fall into the hole. Please, that was just wasted opportunities to have such a badass ending to this entire arc. There should have been more allies, more people joining in, angels versus demons, hunters joining together in this fight, perhaps adding more angels who probably have rebelled or decided to switch teams, aka Lucifer's angels like the ones Uriel wanted to recruit, etc. Definitely would have been way cooler and more epic, for sure.
(Deleted comment)
Renée: Castiel. Guardian angel.rogueslayer452 on July 12th, 2010 01:05 am (UTC)
I don't really have high hopes for the next season, though. Due to my disappointment with how things have been handled I'm going in with low expectations.
Kevin Jonesmulder200 on July 12th, 2010 02:04 am (UTC)
Dean/Castiel is love! It's my total obsession!

Sam/Dean is just gross! Now I can buy it if it's AU and they are not brothers but other that that just no.

I'm also a big fan of Sam/Lucifer. They are so alike in their messed-upness.

I am not a big fan of Sam/Castiel and Sam/Gabriel. I can read them if they are good but other that just no.

As for Dark Angel, I liked Max/Logan before they ran that ship into the ground into the second season. Now I just like Logan/Alec.
Renée: Dean/Castiel. Never change.rogueslayer452 on July 12th, 2010 02:55 am (UTC)
I have never shipped anyone on this show before Dean/Castiel, and I've never been as attached to a pairing like I am with them. They are so much love I cannot stand it. ♥

I wished they spent more time with Sam and Lucifer, and not just in the "you have a destiny" kind of way. But more about them and their similarities much like how the show expresses time and again the similarities between Dean and Castiel. Because you're absolutely right, they have the same kind of fucked up mentality and anger and I wished they could have explored more into that throughout the season.

Eh, I don't really think they ran Max/Logan into the ground because had there been a third season I think it would have worked out. There was just an obstacle in the way. It's sort of like Booth and Brennan in Bones, of having to keep that distance until they finally get it together.
cheerful_earl: Castielcheerful_earl on July 12th, 2010 10:04 am (UTC)
I am a hardcore Max/Logan shipper. I just adored them so much. But I do see the Zack/Max ship, especially from his side. I think had they reconnected before she got tangled up with Logan and Eyes Only, things could have been really different between them. Personally, I see it way more than Max/Alec, which I don't see at all as a romantic ship.

NO. JUST NO. DO NOT WANT EVER, KILL IT WITH FIRE!

That episode was on the other day (you know, the one with Lisa that makes sense?) and I couldn't watch it. I'm disgruntled. I *like* Lisa. I think she's awesome and a good mom and could be a good friend to Dean, and I DNW that to be messed up for some forced relationship that will, in all probability because HELLO THIS IS SPN, lead to her death.

I was going to snag this meme and do it, but um, my answers would pretty much just be yours (Except Sam/Gabriel. I don't hate it, but IDK, I just don't *get* it yet.)

I liked Haven. I agree, it was sort of shaky; they introduced the main character sort of oddly- I missed completely that she was an FBI agent who sort of looked for and accepted the weird, until I saw the first minute again after Eureka. Hehe.

Speaking of Eureka- yay, James Callis! I can't wait to talk with you about it once you see it! I had no idea what was going on but JAMES! Baltar, I missed you. <3333
Renée: Castiel. Show some respect.rogueslayer452 on July 12th, 2010 09:58 pm (UTC)
There were definite indications that it could have been explored had they done so. I mean, my favorite moment that really sealed this was when they were in the cabin together next to the fireplace, there were strong vibes coming from him that he really did think of her more than just in a brotherly fashion. Logan even suggested it as such at the end. And you're right, Alec/Max had more of a childish bantering kind of relationship, like siblings would.

That episode was on the other day (you know, the one with Lisa that makes sense?) and I couldn't watch it. I'm disgruntled. I *like* Lisa. I think she's awesome and a good mom and could be a good friend to Dean, and I DNW that to be messed up for some forced relationship that will, in all probability because HELLO THIS IS SPN, lead to her death.

It's sad to think that they've ruined a perfectly good female character on the show that actually had some purpose in being a mother-figure without having any sort of continuing relationship with either of the boys. I mean, that's all the show does now, is place a female character either to be evil or to become a love interest, and then of course die. I liked Lisa, and I still do, but what they've done to her by making it seem she's been waiting years in between Dean visiting her, literally having no life of her own, only to allow him in like this to be a "love interest" is just insulting on so many levels. I just, I can't. :/ It makes no logical sense for either character and for the continuity of the story. It's stupid and just, ugh. I can't.

It's one of the incidents that I really wish Sera Gamble would just leave the show entirely, because she does nothing but add random shit when it shouldn't be there for her own pleasures and having no respect to the story being told. I say get rid of her and have Jeremy Carver to take her place, because at least he understands characterization and the flow of things, from what I've seen of his writing anyway (I mean come on, he wrote "Free To Be You And Me", "Point Of No Return", "Changing Channels", "The Rapture" ... his writing is golden on the show, I wish he wouldn't leave when there's hardly any more writers that I trust!)

lol, well we kinda are braintwins in a sense so I'm not surprised. ;p

I'm downloading Eureka right now. I NEEDS MAH GAIUS BALTAR!!!
cheerful_earl: Team Free Willcheerful_earl on July 17th, 2010 08:35 am (UTC)
I think how they present Dean and Lisa in the first episode will definitely set the tone of the season. How that relationship is handled will say a lot- is it going to be that sort of doting "love interest" thing? How will they all act together? The randomness of Lisa's appearance was *so* jarring that I don't even know what they were going for. I too got the impression that she was being shoved in as this waiting love interest of Dean's, but her actions could say "good friend" too, that she really just wanted to help him. I dunno. I guess they could salvage her character easily enough, but I don't think I will ever forget that moment of "Random much?" when Dean showed up at Lisa's door.

I am so sad Jeremy Carver is leaving. I really enjoyed a lot of his episodes- he and Ben Edlund became my favorites over the last couple of seasons. Honestly, before, my favorite was Sera. She wrote some of my favorite S1-S3 episodes (I love "Faith", "All Hell Breaks Loose pt 1", "Jus in Bello", etc) but lately, not so much. I agree, she seems to shove in some completely random stuff that feels really random and inorganic. In a season that will by it's nature have to make a lot of changes, random and inorganic storylines can totally break the show.
Renée: Castiel. Searching for answers.rogueslayer452 on July 17th, 2010 10:02 am (UTC)
but her actions could say "good friend" too, that she really just wanted to help him. I dunno. I guess they could salvage her character easily enough, but I don't think I will ever forget that moment of "Random much?" when Dean showed up at Lisa's door.

I'm hoping so too, because them ruining a character that I like just for that benefit is old and tired for the show, and it easily says that they can't have any recurring female role that doesn't result with them hooking up with either one of the boys. I mean, how insulting is that? I would prefer Lisa to be that "good friend" to Dean rather than love interest, because she has her own life. I mean, she had her own life when she first met him and the second time he approached her, implying that they are ~tru wuv~ or whatever is stupid just based on those random occasions. I just, no. I don't buy or accept that at all.

I honestly never really had much of an opinion on Sera Gamble or many of the writers before, since I didn't necessarily focus on that prior to the fourth season (I mainly just watched the show, I didn't care about who wrote/directed what at that time), but I think Sera Gamble kind of just wants to do things her way and after reading some interviews with her she doesn't come across as a writer that understands the material that much these days, especially recently in this last season. I think she even stated that she disliked the whole angel storyline, which if she was taking control in the last half of the season explains why they didn't even focus on that aspect at all. She doesn't come across at getting characterizations right or respect the characters and their journeys that much these days, and it really shows in the writing.

I do admit there are episodes of hers that I have enjoyed, but overall she definitely not my favorite writer and I don't particular like her input or direction about the show. Hence why I don't like the fact she's running the show now. I would have preferred Jeremy Carver or Ben Edlund over her, tbh.