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28 March 2015 @ 05:41 am
Mulder, it's me.  
++ The X-Files is returning for a six-episode miniseries run, with Gillian Anderson and David Duchovny back as Mulder and Scully. While I never got into the show while it aired, probably only watched a few scattered episodes here and there along with the 1998 movie when it came out, I definitely understand the pop culture influence and the importance it held for many people. So this news is quite exciting as the fandom is being revived, as I've seen so much stuff popping up more than usual on my Tumblr dash, from all the various memes and whatnot. Also, watching and listening to that David Duchovny song that was created way back when was an experience in itself (oh, 90s nostalgia).

++ Also: Every Argument About Buffy On The Internet, From 1998 Until Now.

Granted this isn't every single argument since I know there have been dozens of wanks and flamewars involved, but otherwise yeah, that is scarily accurate. It's interesting because I wasn't that involved with the BTVS online fandom until after the show ended (which was when I created my LJ), so I wasn't aware of most of the heated debates and arguments that happened throughout on different forums and other places on the Internet since the beginning. It's fascinating, really, seeing that even some remnants of these same arguments have continued on even after all this time, rehashed by old fans and newbies alike. Most of these debates will probably never die. But hey, that is life of being in fandom, for better or worse.
 
 
Current Mood: lethargiclethargic
Current Music: Soles - Love Will Have Its Sacrifices
 
 
 
Denorios: david duchovny geekdenorios on March 28th, 2015 02:44 pm (UTC)
The X-Files was pretty much my first real fandom, and Mulder and Scully one of my first OTPs - so I'm sort of ridiculously but cautiously excited by all this!
Renéerogueslayer452 on March 29th, 2015 03:52 am (UTC)
I've seen some people being cautiously enthusiastic about this news, as well. Depending on how it's delivered, reviving a show with its original cast can go either way. Of course most of the excitement is just seeing Mulder and Scully back on screen again no matter what, heh.
Christina: actor- zachary- first days of springfly_meaway on March 28th, 2015 03:01 pm (UTC)
Will you be checking out the new The X-Files stuff? Like you, I only watched a few random episodes here and there, that's it, so I'm curious how you feel about that. I probably won't watch it myself though, but I'm happy and excited for my friends who love this show.

I was also never that involved with the BTVS fandom, though I watched all the episodes as it aired over here, but yeah, that article points out a lot of arguments for sure. A lot of arguments that I agree with wholeheartedly too, lol.
Renée: Katherine. Curiosity.rogueslayer452 on March 29th, 2015 01:46 am (UTC)
I'm not sure. I may just live vicariously through the people on Tumblr squeeing about it, as they already have been, and if it peaks my curiosity even further I may have to check it out.
Julie: AoE ★ hierurgyragnarok_08 on March 28th, 2015 05:08 pm (UTC)
The six-part miniseries sounds intrguing for The X-Files.
Renéerogueslayer452 on March 29th, 2015 05:34 am (UTC)
They say that it'll only be six episodes, though judging if it does well I don't know if they'll expand to more. Some people would want more, some aren't too keen on the idea. It really depends on how well it's executed.

Edited at 2015-03-29 05:34 am (UTC)
we can't give up. that's the deal.: rachel // goofyomgpeyton on March 28th, 2015 06:40 pm (UTC)
Hahaha that link is the best. I binge watched Buffy when I was 12-13 so I was a part of the fandom at the very end of the series. I was a part of an SMG board and a lot of these arguments were definitely present. I have to say that Buffy is one of the first shows I watched really young where I liked certain things/ships and then watched it again as an adult and.. it was a completely different experience!
Renée: BTVS. Buffy Summers.rogueslayer452 on March 29th, 2015 05:32 am (UTC)
I have to say that Buffy is one of the first shows I watched really young where I liked certain things/ships and then watched it again as an adult and.. it was a completely different experience!

Pretty much the same with me. While BTVS was quite influential during my formative years, I realize that after revisiting the series several times after the show has ended my perspective on certain things have shifted. Like opinions and thoughts on specific characters and relationships and what was presented through the storytelling. Which isn't necessarily bad, mind you. It just has made me understand things that many have written in various metas and through personal observations that I haven't noticed before, and has really made me think.

It's similar with other things I revisit, like Harry Potter, for example. When you read/watch it as a kid/teenager is very different from how you view it through the perspective of an adult.
💋: set for the playmaybe on March 28th, 2015 07:28 pm (UTC)
I am super excited for the x-files return, I watched it while it was airing - probably my very first fandom, before I knew what fandom was.
Renée: Kaylee. Giddy.rogueslayer452 on March 30th, 2015 01:57 am (UTC)
I'm so happy for your excitement, sweetie. :)

I love how we all have that beloved fandom before we even knew what fandom was, specifically in terms of the online fandom.
Kim: Jacksonsaturnsdaughter on March 28th, 2015 07:31 pm (UTC)
One of these days I'll commit to re-watching Buffy. I watched the first two seasons again a few years ago and realized how much was going over my head as a kid. To this day, I still haven't watched the series finale. I know a little about what happens but I wasn't ready for it to be over at the time.
Renée: BTVS. Buffy Summers.rogueslayer452 on March 29th, 2015 05:39 am (UTC)
I constantly have BTVS rewatches. Sometimes it'll just start off with one episode, but like with most things it'll turn into a few more and then oops! I've basically watched the entire season. ;)

The series finale was pretty much awesome. It was quite empowering when I saw it, and it still holds up to this day. Just so you know when you finally decide to watch it. :)

What's funny though is that while I have all of the Buffy DVDs, I don't think I ever completed my Angel collection. At least not the last two seasons.
Kimsaturnsdaughter on March 29th, 2015 02:15 pm (UTC)
That's good to know. :)

It's kind of funny now but I refused to watch Angel when it was on. I was so bitter about him and Buffy breaking up, even after she had clearly started to move on. I know bits and pieces about what went on from friends and the internet, but I was stubborn about it. Someday I'll give at least season one a shot to see how I feel. It does seem to have all the elements of shows I like.
author_by_night: cool_largeauthor_by_night on March 28th, 2015 07:37 pm (UTC)
I didn't see the show when it ran either; I watched it years and years later.

... and now I have thoughts. Ahem.

Re: the feminist stuff - eh. I don't think he's as progressive as fandom makes him out to be, but I think in 1996, a lot of it was quite revolutionary, and honestly, even now you have faux action girls up the wazoo; Buffy obviously subverts that with Buffy being capable of holding her own. Part of the problem too was that there was probably a looot of executive meddling.

And it also doesn't help that back then, a snarky action girl was pretty new. Now that's pretty much any action chick. That's not a bad thing, I'm just saying, one of Buffy's genre-changing characteristics is now a commonality..

Joss Whedon Doesn’t Understand What Bisexuality Is

In fairness to Joss Whedon, I have a gay friend who was married and had a kid, and she does not refer to herself as bi, but she's also said she didn't know she was gay until she met a woman. So it does happen IRL that people - like Willow - fall in love with someone of the same gender and say they're gay instead of bi. OTOH, society as a whole seems to have issues acknowledging that bisexuals exist, so.


Season Six Felt Like Watching My Friends Get Murdered In Slow Motion Right In Front Of Me

I definitely liked season six less precisely for that reason, but I also thought that was the point? Whether or not it was a particularly well-executed one is up for debate, however.

Xander: I think Xander depends on what episode we're talking; you can tell some writers hated the guy, whereas he was a creator's pet for others. :P Generally I don't think he was the "only human" one, but I also don't think he was "a greater monster than Angelus", and I certainly don't see him inventing "nice guy" syndrome! I think that honor belongs to Jonathan and Andrew, honestly - they want to be seen as nice, nerdy, awkward guys, but no, they're creepy and do ethically shady things. Unless I'm misunderstanding what a "nice guy" is.

Jenny Calendar And Race-Bending

Wait - what? This one confuses me. Because she had Roma blood?

THE EPISODE WHERE WILLOW ATTENDS THE WICCAN MEETING IS WICCAN-SHAMING

Honestly, I thought this one was a crack at school organizations where everyone basically just wants to talk about the next bake sale. Because let me tell you, I was the Willow at many of those meetings.





Edited at 2015-03-28 07:43 pm (UTC)
Renéerogueslayer452 on March 30th, 2015 01:53 am (UTC)
And it also doesn't help that back then, a snarky action girl was pretty new. Now that's pretty much any action chick. That's not a bad thing, I'm just saying, one of Buffy's genre-changing characteristics is now a commonality..

Yeah, and it happens with a lot of things, Tolkien for example was pretty much the grandfather of the fantasy genre with Lord of the Rings, which most fantasy tried to mimic afterwards. I've noticed that some things try to become like BTVS or say that they're like it, but they don't come even close.

With things like Buffy and Xena: Warrior Princess, the 90s was kind of revolutionary for its time having a woman be forefront of her own story and kind of approaching a genre like that the way they did. They certainly had feminist themes and subverted a lot of the stereotypes seen in such genres. The whole concept about Buffy was that, as a Slayer, she was supposed to follow the specific rules, but she decided to say, "nope! I'm gonna have friends and go to school and have a life." Never mind how she decided to no longer take orders from the Watcher's Council, and how they were allowed back into the fold on her terms. Buffy was a huge influential aspect in my formative years. As far as Joss Whedon himself, I'm no stranger to the disillusionment that I've gotten over the years. I don't think he's perfect, and I have disagreed plenty with some things that he's done, but I don't have a massive hatred of him like others seem to have. I appreciate what he's done and what he's created, and what he continues to create with other things.

So it does happen IRL that people - like Willow - fall in love with someone of the same gender and say they're gay instead of bi.

Exactly. And to be honest, this whole argument has always rubbed me the wrong way. I understand the frustration about the lack of acknowledgment and discussion about bisexuality within canon (which unfortunately is still a problem today with the media shying away from recognizing it as a legitimate sexuality), but blatantly ignoring Willow identifying as a lesbian in canon and saying she's bisexual instead is equally as wrong. There are plenty of people IRL who were strictly in heterosexual relationships and identified as heterosexual prior to discovering their own sexuality, be it homosexual or bisexual or pansexual or asexual, etc. Their past relationships shouldn't be invalidated or discredited because of that, nor should those past relationships be the sole identifier of who that person should be. Sexuality doesn't always fit inside a particular box.

I find it strange that this argument is still happening today when so many people are becoming more and more aware about sexual identity and the non-binary. We can talk about the disappointment about the lack of representation of bisexuality (and any other sexuality) in general, but don't try to say Willow isn't a lesbian when she clearly self identifies as such within the show.

I definitely liked season six less precisely for that reason, but I also thought that was the point? Whether or not it was a particularly well-executed one is up for debate, however.

I liked the general concept of the sixth season, of everyone dealing with adult responsibilities (or not and then dealing with the harsh consequences), especially Buffy and her depression. In hindsight I can understand where they wanted to go with it. It's just the execution was definitely not that great, and I think the dramatic shift from switching networks and then the mood from metaphorical to literal in terms of character pain and the demons they were facing really jarred fans.

Wait - what? This one confuses me. Because she had Roma blood?

Yeah, I'm confused by this one as well. Perhaps it has something to do with the gypsy association?

Essentially, there are so many arguments and debates that have happened in this fandom that, even though this list was impressive of bringing up some of the biggest and even lesser known ones, it's impossible to list every single one that has occurred throughout the many fandom spaces. Though people in the comments are bringing up some of the other ones not mentioned.
author_by_nightauthor_by_night on March 30th, 2015 02:16 am (UTC)
I've noticed that some things try to become like BTVS or say that they're like it, but they don't come even close.

I think a lot of things miss what made Buffy work so well to begin with. The humor, the bitterness, the dialogue, the characters... it all just sticks with you, and I think a lot of shows/books/films that have tried to emulate that fail to hit those notes.

. Sexuality doesn't always fit inside a particular box.


That's a very good point, actually.


Samarsakuraberries on March 29th, 2015 12:24 am (UTC)
X-Files! I watched seasons 7-9 when I was a teenager then went back and watched 1-6 in college, but I never got around to rewatching 7-9. Been meaning to for years, though; perhaps this will be my motivation?

That Buffy list is great, omg. I was never in the Buffy fandom, as it was before my time, but I've seen plenty of those arguments when I went back into the depths of Livejournal (have you read any of eleusis_walks's stuff?).

Edited at 2015-03-29 12:25 am (UTC)
Renée: Elementary. Joan Watson.rogueslayer452 on March 29th, 2015 03:38 am (UTC)
Perhaps it could be. I've seen the entire X-Files awaken from its slumber and some people are considering having a massive rewatch.

I have not read their stuff (very few entries are public on their journal now, apparently). Though I'm always fascinated when I see different sorts of meta from the fandom, gabrielleabelle is someone who has had plenty of interesting means of meta and open discussion on their journal regarding the show, among other things.
R.: fairy tales are more than truependeries on March 29th, 2015 01:09 am (UTC)
It would've been so fun, yet so exhausting, to actually be part of the Buffy fandom when it aired. Oi vey.
Renéerogueslayer452 on March 29th, 2015 01:55 am (UTC)
Believe me, with some of these arguments still happening in corners of the Internet, it's still exhausting. :S Though it has created some interesting food for thought discussions over the years, let me tell you.
Adrienne Ashley Joneshypermint on March 29th, 2015 05:11 am (UTC)
To be completely honest, JAG was my first fandom - I think, it was the first fiction I was reading, anyway -, but X Files was just one of those shows that I kept coming back to even though I would have nightmares. I caught a lot of the early seasons some years back, but I was happy with I Want to Believe.
tardis_stowaway: mulder/scully <3tardis_stowaway on March 29th, 2015 07:23 am (UTC)
I have mixed feelings about the X-Files coming back. On the one hand, I fucking loved that show back in the day. It gave me my first OTP and my first experiences reading fanfic. The good episodes of that show were phenomenal television.

On the other hand, it jumped the shark rather badly in later seasons. It's one of the few times I've quit watching a show I once truly loved. The second movie made my shipper heart ridiculously happy, but otherwise was a steaming pile of crap. Even if they can conjure up a better script than the latter seasons of the show or the second movie, I don't know if they can make it work in this day and age. The X-Files was very much a creature of its time.

But if they are attempting a revival, I think that a limited-run series is perhaps the best possible format. The stars seem genuinely keen on it. I'm not letting my expectations get too high, but I'm also not going to condemn it before it appears. I suppose what I'm saying is that I want to believe.

Thanks for linking to the video of Bree Sharp's "David Duchovny" song! I knew and loved the song when it came out, but being in the days before youtube I'd never seen the video. That was amazing! (And amazingly 90s!)

I can say from experience at the edges of Buffy internet fandom that the Buffy article is extremely accurate. It leaves off a few, including "If This is In Southern California Then Why Is Everyone White" and various Riley-related arguments that it looks like the comment section is exploring.
Renéerogueslayer452 on March 29th, 2015 11:17 am (UTC)
I've seen similar concerns, which all are quite valid. I know that the later seasons of The X-Files weren't that favorable because they were kind of running out of ideas of what to do, and nowadays the whole conspiracy theory about aliens isn't that new of a concept, since there have been plenty of shows in recent years going with that general theme (aliens, conspiracies, etc.) There is no denying that The X-Files was a product of its time.

But again, it goes into how well the revival is executed in writing and direction. Perhaps there might be something new to go from, something that may spawn something interesting. And even if it doesn't, there will still be Mulder/Scully which I'm sure fans will always be for no matter what. ;)

And you're welcome! I knew of the song since plenty of people have referenced it before, but I never heard it or saw the video until just recently. It's both hilarious and fascinating since it shows that even without the use of YouTube videos like these also existed back then. lol

(Also, I loved seeing everything 90s, including SMG's S3!Buffy era featured for a brief second)

It leaves off a few, including "If This is In Southern California Then Why Is Everyone White" and various Riley-related arguments that it looks like the comment section is exploring.

Ah yes. Also the whole "Marti Noxon Killed Our Show" debate when she became the showrunner for S6 and S7, everything surrounding why BTVS transferred to UPN when Angel was still on the WB (and then later the arguments about the WB canceling Angel); then the "SMG Hates The Show And Everyone In The Cast Hates Each Other" when the series was nearing its end. There are so many arguments that happened within fandom over a variety of things, from in-verse to behind the scenes, it's hard to really keep track of every single one of them that occurred over the years on multiple places around the Internet.
Pattywoodycakes on March 31st, 2015 02:20 pm (UTC)
I am excited for X-Files as well. I saw the movies and watched a couple episodes/seasons but never in full. therefore this calls for a re-watch haha :D